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Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 2011 > Jun > Jun 15

Re: Third Kingdom Experiences

From: Dave Haith <visions1.nul>
Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2011 22:57:59 +0100
Archived: Wed, 15 Jun 2011 05:50:34 -0400
Subject: Re: Third Kingdom Experiences


>From: William Treurniet <wtreurniet.nul>
>To: post.nul
>Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2011 16:58:15 -0400
>Subject: Re: Third Kingdom Experiences

>>From: Dave Haith <visions1.nul>
>>To: UFO UpDates<post.nul>
>>Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2011 11:14:05 +0100
>>Subject: Re: Third Kingdom Experiences

>>>From: Jerome Clark<jkclark.nul>
>>>To:<post.nul>
>>>Date: Fri, 10 Jun 2011 08:12:36 -0500
>>>Subject: Re: Alien Museum On Alien Abduction Case

><snip>

>>>Such experiences of the ostensibly supernatural (or, if you
>>>prefer, extraordinarily anomalous) can be sustained, complex,
>>>and extremely hard to explain, either literally or prosaically.
>>>They occur in what has been called liminal space, partly
>>>objective,>partly subjective, a kind of Third Kingdom that
>>>mocks our lazy>notion that either things are or they aren't. By
>>>their nature>we can neither prove nor disprove them. They exist
>>>- often>vividly - in experience, and experience alone.

>>Jerry, it's your last sentence here I'd like to comment on:
>>"They exist - often vividly - in experience, and experience
>>alone."

>>But my point in discussing The Gold Leaf Lady and Skinwalker and
>>if you like acres of parapsychological literature, is that just
>>sometimes these things exist in experience but also NOT in
>>experience alone.

>>There are such things as 'apports' - solid objects which
>>seemingly 'arrive' from elsewhere as in the brass in Braude's
>>case, the prize bulls which were moved from a field to
>>a container in the Skinwalker case and umpteen coins,
>>jewellery and photographs in the Scole case.

>>How do we fit these permanent incursions into our solid physical
>>world into your Third Kingdom concept except by surmising that
>>there is a multi-dimensional universe where there can
>>occasionally be 'bleed throughs' from other worlds to ours?

>Hi Dave,

>Excuse the long post, but it's about a possible mechanism behind
>experiences of high strangeness.

>You are drawn to the idea of a multi-dimensional universe to
>explain the spontaneous appearance of apported objects. In the
>cases I've heard about, the objects that appear spontaneously
>are often familiar. I would not expect this if they were from
>another world as you suggest. When an apported object is
>recognizable, it seems more likely that its origin is the world
>in which we live.

>What we need is a mechanism to explain the instantanous
>displacement of the object from one location in our space/time
>to another. Such a mechanism might be applicable to a broad
>range of weird physical occurrences, such as the sudden
>appearance and disappearance of unidentified objects in the sky.

<snip>

I have snipped your fascinating technical explanation for high
strangeness William, not because it may not be highly relevant,
but because I frankly don't understand it.

I will leave it to others with a scientific mind as keen as
yours to comment on or dissect it.

But all I will say about your remarks above, is that there
appears to be a difference between apported objects in the
Spiritualist scenario and UFOs.

The apports, as you say, are usually common earth objects which
appear to have been moved from where they originated, to - for
instance - the s=E9ance room.

Of course the Spiritualists' explanation is that 'spirit' - or
the other dimensional world of the dead - is the agency
responsible for performing this very neat trick.

But UFOs on the other hand are not - we presume - common earth
objects and therefore could conceivably come from another
dimension.

During the Scole Experiment they seemed to have two different
phenomena in this area - apports which stayed and could be kept
as solid objects and paranormal objects which became visible and
appeared to be solid, but which 'dissolved' leaving no physical
trace.

These latter type included many miniature UFOs - looking all the
world like the lighted discs we are familiar with - but unlike
apported familiar objects, they were irretrievable afterwards.

All I can say is that to my non-technical mind, this would make
some degree of sense in that earth objects could be moved from
one place to another but objects from another dimension couldn't
permanently manifest in this dimension.

In the Skinwalker case remember the giant wolf they shot at?
Lumps of apparent flesh broke off the body but dissolved into
nothing, shortly afterwards - suggesting that it was
interdimensional
in origin and couldn't permanently survive in our world.


Dave Haith



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