From: Don Ledger <dledger.nul> Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2011 13:54:47 -0300 Archived: Mon, 18 Jul 2011 13:49:38 -0400 Subject: Re: Devastating Critique Of Jacobsen's 'Area 51' >From: Joshua Laudermilk <joshua.laudermilk.nul> >To: post.nul >Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2011 08:52:13 -0400 >Subject: Re: Devastating Critique Of Jacobsen's 'Area 51' Book >>From: Don Ledger <dledger.nul> >>To: post.nul >>Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2011 14:57:16 -0300 >>Subject: Re: Devastating Critique Of Jacobsen's 'Area 51' Book >>I have been given to understand over the years that S-4 meant >>South or Sector 4. Had some other complex such as a "Sigma 4" >>been in existence I think it highly unlikely that Test pilot >>Tony LeVier would have missed it while out out looking around >>for and rediscovering what is now Groome Lake some new area in >>which Lockheed could test fly the U-2 prototype. >The blame for all this has fallen too easily upon Annie >Jacobsen. I called her a liar previously, and part of the reason >for that was her co-operation with DHS and now with the USG in >spreading disinformation. However, Ms. Jacobsen was reporting >what she was told by her source, an EG&G engineer. It was the >EG&G engineer who claimed that S-4 stood for Sigma-4, and Ms. >Jacobsen says that she found documents (I can't remember now if >it was from an FOIA request or not) that show that the Manhattan >Project was colloquially referred to as S-1 or Sigma-1. Both Ms. >Jacobsen and her source indicate that this is very much the >style of Vannevar Bush, who (as her source reports) was head of >both projects, and presumably in charge of S-2 and S-3, which >are undisclosed projects. >Ms. Jacobsen confirms Robert Lazar's employment at Area 51 >through contractor EG&G, which I was surprised by since I >considered Mr. Lazar to be a fraud, a government disinformation >plant at best. Mr. Lazar, as far as I can tell, was the first to >report about S-4. I'm not remembering now if he stated that S-4 >meant Sector-Four of if that was the result of later >interpretations. While Ms. Jacobsen's source says that S-4 was >located about 5 1/2 miles north of Area 12 and Area 15 (or 16 >miles northwest of Groom Lake), Mr. Lazar puts the location of >S-4 at a different location entirely, and Lazar puts S-4 as >being at/near Papoose Lake, specifically hidden under the >Papoose Range, where it is not possible to get a view of. >Further, the EG&G engineer also reports that S-4 (at least the >original S-4) was a very small facility, with a total faculty of >five hand selected (by Vannevar Bush) EG&G engineers. If the >Sigma project thing was just some attempt to sexy up S-4, it was >not Ms. Jacobsen's doing or innovation, rather it should be >attributed to her EG&G source. >>It wasn't just Brad Sparks who doubted the balloon theory but >>Brad certainly did the hard research and proved the lie about >>Charles Moore's-and the USAF's- Mogul balloon explanation. >My point wasn't that Mr. Sparks was the first one to doubt the >Project Mogul disinfo, but that the authors of the article cited >buy into the Project Mogul explanation. >>I see that there is one on here who still thinks that Jacobsen >>was thinking 'outside of the box'. Apparently if Jacobsen's book >>is an example of wild-eyed speculation and any foolish theory >>regardless of how silly it might be is claimed as 'thinking >>outside the box' while reason and common sense when it comes to >>theories have no value. >I know you are aware of how many think that the ETH explanation, >as given by me and others, is equally if not more wild-eyed >speculative and foolish and silly than the EG&G source (via Ms. >Jacobsen) gives. I was thinking that the new hypothesis >presented was outside the box and would make those seeking a >third position on Roswell, that something happened but it wasn't >a Mogul baloon or an ET craft, would be happy to receive this >new hypothesis. Karl Pflock and Brad Sparks are but two who do >not support the previous positions but were looking for another >explanation. Perhaps the Roswell Incident was the result of a >meteroite, asteroid or comet. There's a third position right >there. Or, a more colorful and exciting third position is the >Stalin-Mengele callaboration with the help of nazi scientists at >NII-88. >>No one who has an inkling of what was going on at the War's end >>would give any credence to this volume of fiction. >Most people I encounter wouldn't give any credence to me putting >forth an extratterestrial origin for the Roswell Incident. And >I've explained the ETH to many people and the past and they >thought both ETH and what I had to say were stupid. So while you >and I don't buy into the EG&G engineer's reporting of events, a >cursory overview of the reviews of Ms. Jacobsen's book on >Amazon.com shows that very many who consider the EG&G source's >story to be ridiculous, consider the ETH explanation to be >equally preposterous, outlandish and unbelievable. >Josh The comments I put up here a couple of days ago were not intended to argue the ETH or the Roswell event. I leave Roswell to Stan Friedman, Kevin Randle and others. The ETH is another argument entirely. Bob Lazar has been adequately vetted over the years by better investigators than Anne Jacobsen. She wrote what was supposed to be a work of non-fiction so the onus is on her to back up her facts. As for the S-4, it could be as simple as a hangar designation or some building complex. Many of those who find themselves reporting about this phenomenon, or specific sections of it in the media have little in the way of good background material on which to rely. They don't do their homework and are usually happy to go with any simplistic resolution to a story that protects them from ridicule. Don Ledger Listen to 'Strange Days... Indeed' - The PodCast At: http://www.virtuallystrange.net/ufo/sdi/program/ These contents above are copyright of the author and UFO UpDates - Toronto. They may not be reproduced without the express permission of both parties and are intended for educational use only.
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