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Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 2011 > Feb > Feb 24

Re: Special Note From Budd Hopkins

From: John Rimmer <johnrimmer.nul>
Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 14:57:32 +0000 (GMT)
Archived: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 11:13:03 -0500
Subject: Re: Special Note From Budd Hopkins

>From: Jerome Clark <jkclark.nul>
>To: <post.nul>
>Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 05:39:16 -0600
>Subject: Re: Special Note From Budd Hopkins

>Speaking of desperate attempts, I note here the ham-handed
>rhetorical strategy that seeks, yet again, to conflate Hopkins
>and Jacobs, who though friends are not one individual and whose
>methods and conclusions are not the same. Nice try, though,

>And speaking of moral morass, I note here again that your idea
>of a moral arbiter in these matters is character assassin Phil
>Klass. I doubt that even his friends judged him that. I did hear
>a prominent skeptic once characterize him as "despicable,"

Erm, exactly where did I say that Phil Klass was a "moral
arbiter", Jerry or did you just make that up? I think if you
read through the collected wisdom of Magonia you'll find that we
criticise Klass as much as we agree with him.

>I guess the larger conclusion we are to draw from the collected
>wisdom of Rimmer and Klass is that anomalous experiences exist
>in the world because evil people force innocent people to
>imagine them.

Speaking of desperate attempts, I note here the ham-handed
rhetorical strategy that seeks, yet again, to conflate Magonia
and Phil Klass, who were not friends were not one individual and
whose methods and conclusions are not the same. Nice try,
though, Jerry.

>>If you cannot see the problems with Hopkins' methodology, and
>>how it has defined the development of the abduction phenomenon
>>into the dangerous monster it has become today, then you have
>>clearly not read Hopkins's book as carefully as you would have
>>us think.

>And what "dangerous monster" would that be? That some people
>have experiences you don't approve of? That some other people
>actually give them sympathetic attention and try to understand
>what these experiences may be about? That healing may come out
>of that simply because investigators actually _listen_, as
>opposed to, say, dismiss, ridicule, and demean?

And that some people are bolstering other peoples' beliefs that
they are being abducted/attacked/impregnated/controlled by alien
beings. I don't believe that Jerry, nor do you.

>Pretty scary, I'll admit. But I'll concede that the list of
>alleged abductees who complain that Budd Hopkins has ruined
>their lives is too long to count. For example, there's...
>well... um... and ... uh... well, I'm sure they're out there
>somewhere, the legions of the suffering who haven't figured out
>yet how Hopkins ruined their lives because, after all, they're
>too stupid and insensitive to read Magonia.

If people are convinced that alien beings (or maybe some other
sort of non-human intelligence) are abducting/raping them, why
should they blame the person who supports them in their belief?

>Likewise, those dim-witted - or maybe they're lying - mental-
>health professionals whom Budd brought into the research and who
>have worked with him all these years. Obviously, they can't be
>trusted, since they were, uh, _actually there_ and not in
>London, where critics are free from the baleful influence of the
>rude colonials.

I haven't read very much by these people, perhaps you could
provide a few links to papers they have published on the work
they have done with Budd Hopkins? And I don't know why you have
such an obsession with "rude colonials", we have plenty of nut-
case in the Old Country.

>>>If I'm around when you're fading into life's twilight, I will
>>>contribute to the hypothetical forum I mentioned. I do promise,
>>>though, not to be icky about it.

>>Thanks, but no thanks.

>In that case, I'll just put it here while you're still alive:

>The late John Rimmer managed to define himself as both
>"psychosocial ufologist" and "skeptic" and never once

Maybe before we both shuffle of this mortal coil, you could
explain exactly what you mean by this frequently repeated trope.

John Rimmer

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