From: Stanton T. Friedman <fsphys.nul> Date: Sun, 24 Oct 2010 15:16:16 -0300 Archived: Mon, 25 Oct 2010 07:46:40 -0400 Subject: Re: MJ-12 Redux This thread was going too long and too confused, so I would like to summarize things as I see them. 1. Kevin Randle and I agree that we don t have a true provenance for EBD, TF, CT. To him this means they are hoaxes. To me the absence of a provenance tells us nothing about whether they are a hoax or not. Policemen and journalists often deal with anonymous tips. It is the content that matters, not the provenance. Certainly nobody is saying that if the provenance were known, that would make the documents genuine. We know the provenance of documents put forth by Frank Kaufman. The documents were hoaxes 2. With regard to contents, Kevin believes that noted Forensic document expert Peter Tytell s casual comments (clearly indicating his recall was inaccurate), say the TF typeface was a hoax. James Black s professional examination official comments( I did not ask for those items Kevin says Peter says I asked for) Indicate the typeface is from 1940. Quite early enough to say that doesn t rule out legitimacy. There are details such as the obvious fact that the date was typed by 2 typewriters and has a period after it, standard for Van Bush s office. George Elsey saw no problem with it having been typed there. Black, as I have noted, also said the HST signature was added. I found the signature in a Bush file item from Truman. Pflock said the CIA easily could have added it. Forrestal who would have had the original signed copy died in 1949. RHH after all had been DCI. 3.KR felt the data format was at variance with standard practice. I agree, but found many examples of non standard date formats.. some by Hillenkoetter and MJ-12 member Smith 4, KR now no longer claims that RHH s rank is the most important Consideration, but still raises questions. I found many many examples of generic ranks used at the Ike White House. It was standard procedure. Ike also used them in Mandate for Change . 5. KR is not happy about the EBD being sent to Jaime Shandera. Apparently he was unaware that I brought JS and Bill Moore together and they had been working together for years. Jaimie gave a talk at a Burbank UFO conference and had been to archives and met some of Moore s sources.. I can t imagine anybody wanting effective document or Roswell research to send them to Dr. Hynek 6. Critics have objected to the Use of TOP SECRET Restricted on the CT. I found comments from the GAO that they had found examples of that. 7. Critics have complained that there were no TOP SECRET Control Numbers. Two archives have stated they had many TS documents without Control Numbers 8. Some have expressed doubt that RHH wrote the EBD. Dr. Roger Wescott examined 25 genuine RHH documents which I had obtained from the Truman Library and concluded that RHH wrote the Briefing. 9. It had been objected that the CT memo must be a hoax because Robert Cutler was out of the USA on the date it was written. Thus, It would indeed have been a hoax, if it had been signed. It wasn t. That he was out wasn't known until long after document discovery at the Nat. Archives. How did the hoaxer know not to sign it? I was informed of it the same night by phone. It was found in Box 189.. Box 189 was noted on a post card .. as was Reese s pieces and Suitland. Ed Reese was archivist at NARA and known to us. Suitland was also an Archive. It took me 2 years via mandatory classification review to obtain a letter from James Lay, Exec. Sec. of the NSC to Cutler .It (included in my Final Report on Operation Majestic 12 ) clearly indicated that Lay was taking care of things for Cutler during his absence as he had been instructed in the memo found earlier by Robert Todd. George Elsey thought it would have ben standard practice for Lay to prepare the memo to Twining for Cutler. Lay and Cutler sat next to each other at NSC meetings and each got copies of the other s paperwork. How did a hoaxer know this?? 10. There was a howl from the Ufology community when Jerry Clark had the courage to publish my article on The Double Life of Donald Menzel. Menzel provides a good example of highly classified work not being known to the outside world despite all his years of such work. It isn t mentioned in two articles in Sky and Telescope about Menzel. Secrets can indeed be kept. As Kevin has correctly pointed out, I found nothing about MJ-12 in the papers of DHM or Van Bush or the other 9 MJ- 12 members. I can t imagine why it would be expected that I would. These were world class experts at keeping secrets There are tens of millions of classified documents throughout the US including presidential archives many of which I have visited. 11. A major objection by Kevin is that the EBD doesn t say anything about the Aztec and Plains of San Agustin crashes which I am convinced did happen. I certainly agree its says nothing about them. I can find no reason to think that a Preliminary Briefing made during a short session in the Pentagon vault would cover info on two cases that had not received much public discussion. After all a full operational briefing was to follow. Neither Kevin nor I were privy to discussions about what should have been excluded or included 12. There is of course the Pica type fiasco as a result of which Klass paid me $ 1000. For proving him wrong. 13. There are several interesting dates in the EBD such as the date of Smith replacing Forrestal (the only date in a long period when Smith met with HST)the date when Twining went to NM, of the one meeting over several months when HST, Van Bush, and James Forrestal met. 14. KR has objected that not one other document was found mentioning Operation Majestic 12. I didn t find any classified documents in Menzel s papers either. But his secretary and his own comments indicate that he did loads of classified work. I can t imagine the MJ-12 people being careless about security. Stan Friedman Listen to 'Strange Days... Indeed' - The PodCast At: http://www.virtuallystrange.net/ufo/sdi/program/ These contents above are copyright of the author and UFO UpDates - Toronto. They may not be reproduced without the express permission of both parties and are intended for educational use only.
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