From: David Rudiak <drudiak.nul> Date: Tue, 5 May 2009 18:27:54 -0700 Archived: Wed, 06 May 2009 09:35:00 -0400 Subject: Re: Debunkers & ETH >From: Michael Tarbell <mtarbell.nul> >To: UFO UpDates - Toronto <post.nul> >Date: Tue, 05 May 2009 10:40:55 -0600 >Subject: Re: Debunkers & ETH >>From: Ray Dickenson <r.dickenson.nul> >>To: UFO UpDates - Toronto <post.nul> >>Date: Mon, 4 May 2009 18:29:30 +0100 >>Subject: Re: Debunkers & ETH >>>From: Michael Tarbell <mtarbell.nul> >>>To: UFO UpDates - Toronto <post.nul> >>>Date: Sun, 03 May 2009 22:09:14 -0600 >>>Subject: Re: Debunkers & ETH >>>Nevertheless, I do not give serious consideration to the idea >>>that UFOs are meta-physical in the literal sense, primarily >>>because, as you point out, there are plausible physical >>>explanations available (e.g., the ETH). ><snip> >>Apparent nuts'n'bolts craft that can also fade out or 'instantly' >>disappear, to reappear 'almost instantly' elsewhere? >>These could be understood as 'rational', but only if we admit >>there are laws of nature we don't yet know. >I wouldn't hesitate to go on record stating that there are laws >of nature we don't know yet. And, that at least some currently >accepted 'laws' of nature are nothing of the kind. >Of course, this can be used to "rationalize" apparently non- >physical behavior, but it is usually erroneous, as well as lazy, >to do so. >For example, the "disappearance" of a nuts-and-bolts craft does >not necessary imply a violation of conservation of mass or >energy, but only that a formerly visible object is now invisible >(which is already within grasp of human technology for limited >EM bandwidths). >Likewise, should this object "almost instantly" reappear >elsewhere (in such time, say, as to imply superluminal >velocity), one might consider the possibility that there is more >than one object involved, before summarily abandoning the >principles of special relativity. Another simple and conventional explanation for sudden disappearance, compatible with other observations, is that UFOs can exhibit very high accelerations on the order of 100g or 100 times earth gravity. (See, e.g., Paul Hill's book, where he thinks this may explain sudden UFO disappearance.) This means if the object is relatively close by, it moves too fast for the eye to follow, just like a magician seemingly making something "vanish" by suddenly yanking it up his sleeve. E.g., the distance something moves in a given time 't' if it has acceleration 'a' is 1/2 x a x t^2 and a velocity of a x t (just simple Newtonian mechanics, no relativity required). Since g = 9.8 m/sec^2 (call it 10 to keep it round), if a = 100g or 1000 m/sec^2, the UFO moves the following distances in a given time period, achieves the following velocity, and also the following angles (assuming it is 500 m away initially and moves sideways or maybe straight up): 1 sec: 500 m (~.3 mile) 1000 m/s (680 mph) 45 deg 2 sec: 2000 m (1.25 miles) 2000 m/s (1360 mph) 76 deg 3 sec: 4500 m (2.8 miles) 3000 m/s (2040 mph) 84 deg 4 sec: 8000 m (5.0 miles) 4000 m/s (2700 mph) 86 deg 5 sec: 12500 m (7.8 miles) 5000 m/s (3400 mph) 88 deg 10 sec: 50000 m (31 miles) 10000 m/s (6800 mph) 89.4 deg 20 sec: 200000 m (125 miles) 20000 m/s (13600 mph) 89.9 deg Also consider that the maximum extent of your lateral visual field is about 85 degrees (also visual acuity is extremely crude out there) and vertical visual field is ~60 degrees (acuity also very crude). So if the UFO suddenly dashes away at high acceleration and you have no idea which way it has gone so you can quickly redirect your eyes over there, it is out of your field of vision in 2 to 4 seconds, and you may not even notice it after 1 second because your acuity drops off so sharply in the periphery. By 5 to 10 seconds, it would probably be fading from sight because of distance, and by 20 seconds it could already be in low orbit (though not quite at orbital speed, which would take about 26 seconds). If a radar had a rotation rate of 5 seconds, the object would seemingly have "jumped" 8 miles in the first sweep and another 23 miles in the second. If the radar were not long range, it would be off the radar by the third or fourth sweep. This will give the illusion that the object was making big sudden jumps instead of smoothly moving at a very fast rate between radar blips. As Michael notes, sudden disappearance is even more dramatic optically if the object blends in with the background so that it is low contrast. This can be as simple as turning off the lights at night or having a brightness similar to the background sky (isoluminance). The latter principle of isoluminance was used by Allied sub hunters during WWII to render themselves nearly invisible to the eye until they had closed in on Nazi subs, leaving them no time to dive. It wasn't very high tech, just lights strung around the plane and photocells to adjust the brightness of the lights to try to match the sky background. More sophisticated forms of visual concealment or cloaking would involve projecting the background onto the skin of the craft with cameras and a visual display craft skin (such things have already been developed), to new types of optical materials under development that will literally pass light around an object from any direction, rendering it invisible (a true, nearly perfect "cloaking device"). Thus an object could also seem to "wink out" suddenly without going anywhere and using fairly conventonal techniques. No high acceleration or slipping into some other dimension would be necessary. >Etc. The point being, appeal to unknown physical principles, or >abandonment of known ones, should be a tool of last resort. It >is depressing to listen to things like "UFO propulsion is >readily explained by warp drives drawing on vacuum energy", or >similar tripe manufactured from whole cloth. Right, it's usually a good idea to go from what we know now before venturing into the more speculative, maybe already on the frontiers of physics, but still not fully developed. (Another way of invoking Occam's razor) It could be the more conventional explanations will prove inadequate or wrong, but I also think they may be easier for more open-minded skeptics to swallow for now if new, unproven principles are not needed. Study of UFOs can be approached using conventional science despite what the hard-core debunkers may say. That was more or less the approach of the likes of Hermann Oberth, James McCampbell, and Paul Hill, though Oberth and Hill thought UFOs utilized a form of antigravity to explain their observed flight characteristics. McCampbell thought more conventional microwaves and EM propulsion might be adequate. David Rudiak Listen to 'Strange Days... Indeed' - The PodCast At: http://www.virtuallystrange.net/ufo/sdi/subscribers/ Your access info works there too... 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