UFO UpDates
A mailing list for the study of UFO-related phenomena
'Its All Here In Black & White'
Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 2002 > Jun > Jun 15

Re: Request For Investigative &

From: Larry Hatch <larry@larryhatch.net>
Date: Sat, 15 Jun 2002 01:13:37 -0700
Fwd Date: Sat, 15 Jun 2002 09:57:36 -0400
Subject: Re: Request For Investigative &

 >From: Kevin Randle <KRandle993@aol.com>
 >To: ufoupdates@virtuallystrange.net
 >Date: Fri, 14 Jun 2002 09:51:29 EDT
 >Subject: Re: Request For Investigative & Remedial Intervention

 >>>From: John Velez <johnvelez.aic@verizon.net>
 >>>To: ufoupdates@virtuallystrange.net
 >>>Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 13:57:58 -0400
 >>>Subject: Re: Request For Investigative & Remedial Intervention


 >>>They _all_ agree that what they saw was a "metallic
 >>>disc" ..


 >John, List, All -

 >Belief has very little to do with it. The skyhook
 >balloons, made of polyethylene were about 100 feet in
 >diameter and in a sun bright sky would look metallic.
 >Since there was nothing in the background to provide
 >for an estimate of size, nor was there any way for
 >them to judge the height, they assumed something
 >smaller and closer to the ground.

 >The descriptions of the object, taken shortly after the
 >event, however, suggest that they were looking at a
 >balloon. One of the drawings, made by a witness
 >shortly after the event, sure looks like a skyhook
 >balloon. Yes, the records suggest that a balloon could
 >have been over the Godman Army Air Field at the time,
 >but they don't prove it.

 >It is also clear, from the records, that Mantell climbed
 >above 12,000 feet without oxygen, and kept right on
 >climbing, reporting that he was getting closer (which,
 >of course, he was) but the object was still fifty or
 >sixty thousand feet above him when he lost consciousness
 >and his F-51 rolled over into a power dive.
 >There were no indications in the wreckage that he ever
 >regained consciousness and tried to either end the dive
 >or get out of the airplane.

 >This clearly was a tragic accident and the explanation
 >is, a skyhook balloon. The Air Force used Venus, then
 >Venus and a balloon, and finally Venus and two balloons
 >because they were unaware of the skyhook project.

 >Jerry Clark in his massive "The UFO Encyclopedia" Second
 >Edition, (just a quick plug for the book, Jerry) wrote,
 >on page 606, "Though the Skyhook identification is
 >surely correct...) he then explains that Ruppelt was
 >wrong thinking it was launched from Clinton County
 >airport, but came from Camp Ripley.

 >This, I believe illustrates one of the points I have
 >been trying to make about peer review. Here is a case
 >that is solved and yet we are discussing it again.
 >Yes, we must be aware of our history, but if solid peer
 >review existed, then we could move beyond this sort of
 >debate, point to what the peer review had concluded, and
 >use that as a basis for our arguments.

 >I'll say once again, the Mantell case has been solved.
 >Thomas Mantell, a good, competent, and heroic pilot
 >(again I point to his DFC from the Normandy Invasion)
 >saw something he couldn't identify and lost his life
 >trying to get close enough for a good look at it.
 >We now know that it was a skyhook balloon.

Hello Kevin, John, others:

I have to go with Kevin and Jerry on this one.

The Mantell skyhook-saucer earned a place on my personal
"poubelle list" (forgive the French) of discredited sightings.
It comes right before the Frank Scully hoax (Aztec, NM  1948).
Listings are chronological.

My Discredited Sightings List is on the web here:


Before anybody calls me nasty names, I repeat that I spent 17
years compiling a catalog of sightings which I consider much
more interesting than these.

Best wishes

- Larry Hatch

[ Next Message | Previous Message | This Day's Messages ]
This Month's Index |

UFO UpDates Main Index

UFO UpDates - Toronto - Operated by Errol Bruce-Knapp

Archive programming by Glenn Campbell at Glenn-Campbell.com