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Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 1997 > Oct > Oct 13

Re: Abduction Sat 4 Oct 1997

From: Mark Cashman <mcashman@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 1997 12:51:06 -0700
Fwd Date: Mon, 13 Oct 1997 13:44:58 -0400
Subject: Re: Abduction Sat 4 Oct 1997

>  From: UFO UpDates - Toronto <updates@globalserve.net>, on 10/12/97 8:34 PM:
>  From: wlmss@peg.apc.org [Lawrie Williams]
>  Date: Mon, 13 Oct 1997 07:36:06 +1000 (GMT+1000)
>  To: starfriends@esosoft.com, updates@globalserve.net
>  Subject: Abduction Sat 4 Oct 1997.

I hope no one will take undeserved offense, but it seems to me as
a researcher and investigator that this account of an
"investigation" represents much of the problem I have with
abduction "research".

I will also say as a parent that this is the kind of thing that
worries me the most about parents and investigators who
uncritically accept abduction as reality. What psychological
effect the actions by the investigator will have can hardly be
determined, but they are unlikely to be positive.

>  My informant is D, aged 16. She has a girlfriend K, also 16.
>  I interviewed D on Oct 3 1997 and reported to the Internet
>  that she had seen an orange glow in a nearby paddock a week
>  earlier.

>  K remembered more. Through the past week she has kept insisting
>  that it was not a dream. She says she was on a "spaceship". She
>  says was on an operating table surrounded by small beings. She
>  saw them slice her belly open crosswise, then she was running
>  through the woods with her baby, and they were chasing her,
>  trying to take it off her.

>  I told D that she could reassure her friend she would come to no
>  harm. I was told J is not afraid, just very curious. Neither girl
>  would dream of trying to tell their parents about this.

So the child has either

a) Had a horrifying real experience


b) A terrifying dream

But the investigator reassures them that "no harm will come to
them". On what basis? Still, this is far better than what is to come.

I am also very concerned that the witnesses are not sharing this
information with parents, and I wonder whether the investigator
has encouraged them to do so.

>  I told her in my opinion the visitation was by an actual craft
>  with humanoids, because this is consistent with similar incidents
>  taking place around the world. I said the experience would have
>  slipped into a dream, like the part about running through the
>  woods.

Consistency is not sufficient to determine reality. The
investigator should know that. At least, the investigator should
follow the primary principle of objective investigation and not
contribute information to the witnesses which could corrupt later

>  I told D that K could expect a phantom pregnancy, but that it would
>  be ended with another visitation. I said this could be three months,
>  but that perhaps someone on the Internet could give me a more likely
>  "term". (K is unlikely to be pregnant by any human, so it looks like
>  a classic potential "maiden birth", what is mistakenly known as
>  "virgin birth" since ancient times - a mistranslation.)

This is even worse. Now the "investigator" has laid out the
entire scenario for the witnesses. If a hoax is in progress, it
will be improved. If the experience was a dream or psychological
in origin, it will lead to additional problems. And if the
experience was real, we will never know, since it has been
corrupted beyond repair.

>  I told her that it could be possible that the purpose of all this
>  was to make hybrids, half like us and half like them.

>  Because K is of a fairly strong Christian background, I warned
>  D about the dangers of K being attracted into a cult which uses
>  the old ideology and paints it onto a framework that includes
>  spaceships and other modern terminology. I said that if this
>  girl now develops an inner voice it is likely to claim to be
>  a saint she is familiar with.

>  I said that she could also expect some of a wide range of known
>  paranormal effects like clairvoyance, clairaudience, astral travel,
>  oob's, levitation or long-striding. We agreed the levitation would
>  be the most fun. The girls are not overly familiar with current
>  UFO mythology and were unaware that K's experience seems to be a
>  classic abduction of its type. I confess I was fairly bemused to
>  hear almost a stereotyped description but I am sure it is authentic.

>  My informant was also startled to see a tiny person dash across her
>  bedcovers. She seemed to think it was an actual hallucination rather
>  than an illusion, after I described the perceptual difference between
>  the two. I told her that calling it an hallucination did not mean a
>  humanoid had actually not been there. This happened days after the
>  actual visitation.

The unethical behavior of this "investigator" is astonishing to
me. I hope that the names of the abductees will be made available
to the major organizations so that if this tale finds its way
into the files, serious researchers will know how contaminated it

>  Note that this is not something that happened a year ago or to a
>  FOAF. I am right here following this one, with care and respect
>  and more than a little awe.

Too bad a little care and respect for the witness and for the
research community didn't enter into this "investigation".

I can only tenuously hope that if the witness has psychological
problems either caused by or resulting from the alleged "event",
that their parents will notice, seek professional help, and
isolate these teenagers from this "investigator".

>  D reviewed the above file and said it was OK. I also have met
>  her mother who mentioned that D was very frightened every night.
>  She seemed to want me to reassure her daughter. I said I could
>  not do that honestly, save to say she was probably not going to
>  be harmed that the perceived phenomena would fade over a few
>  months, indeed they were likely to suddenly come good and seem
>  benevolent. The mother knew more than I expected.

Well, at least the mother knows something. But the investigator
seems blissfully unaware of the potential psychological effects
of comments and information provided to the witnesses and the

Also, one wonders whether the investigator is aware of the
"Stockholm Syndrome" and its effect on witness perspective.

>  The mother challenged me to suggest what "they" could want with
>  her daughter. In light of the conversation I'd earlier had with
>  D, and as D made no suggestion, I had to say I did not know. I
>  just quoted Charles Fort: "We are farmed."

That's a calming, helpful comment (sarcasm).

>  D also claims that the "scar" behind her ear that she got after
>  the childhood visitation has returned. Both she and her boyfriend
>  attest that it was not there before last weekend. I saw three
>  brown blobs there like normal skin discoloration you see in
>  blonde people. But I took a photo of it anyway.

Signs of confabulation ignored by the investigator.

>  Naturally I shall have to spare no effort to protect these girls
>  from exposure and intimidation, however I have already been in
>  touch with several local UFO groups to let them know this is
>  going on.

Maybe these girls need to be protected from investigation.

>  I shall report further, and seek to make a direct interview
>  with K if it seems warranted. I hope I have done right so far.

You haven't.

A reputable investigator wouldn't treat an NL case as shabbily as
this case has been treated. The data are worthless, because the
investigator has told the witnesses the entire profile of the
phenomenon. Any psychological impact of a real event or
psychological cause of a non-real event has been made worse by
lightly considered comments which could be extremely

Basic things seem to have been overlooked:

Has any effort been made to determine if the witnesses have any
psychological problems? Yes, this must be a first step in
checking an abduction. Reference to a reputable psychologist with
no particular interest in UFOs might even be considered
essential, regardless of the truth or reality of the account. If
the account is true, psychological counseling is needed. If the
account is not true, but stems from psychological problems or
incipient problems, then a psychologist is needed to determine

Has any effort been made to determine the level of familiarity
the witness has with the abduction literature (access to The
Learning Channel is even sufficient, now)? This must be done to
help determine the probability of a hoax.

Has any effort been made to investigate the background of the
witnesses and their families? This helps both to determine
credibility and the possibility of a hoax.

Has any effort been made to determine if there are any
corroborating sightings in the area of these events at the time
of these events? This is essential to determine the reality of
the event - conformance to profile is not sufficient in this

I try to keep a level head in these matters, but psychological
mistreatment of children, which is what this "investigation"
seems clearly to represent, outrages me. Teenage girls, just
developing sexual attitudes that will affect the rest of their
life, are essentially being told that they have been raped by
aliens, will experience a pregnancy, and then their child will be
taken by those same aliens. The effects of this are

Mark Cashman, creator of The Temporal Doorway at
- Original digital art, writing, and UFO research -
Author of SF novels available at...

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