UFO UpDates
A mailing list for the study of UFO-related phenomena
'Its All Here In Black & White'
Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 1997 > Oct > Oct 9

Becker Claims Copyright Infringement by Maccabee

From: campbell@ufomind.com (Glenn Campbell, Las Vegas)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 1997 18:59:52 -0800
Fwd Date: Thu, 09 Oct 1997 22:20:02 -0400
Subject: Becker Claims Copyright Infringement by Maccabee

Barbara Becker has claimed copyright infringement in an on-line
article by Bruce Maccabee posted to this list on Oct. 4.

Becker has threatened to file a lawsuit against Glenn Campbell,
Bruce Maccabee, Errol Bruce-Knapp and another party to seek
"injunctuive, punitive and statuatory damages from Glenn and
punitive and statuatory from the rest of you...."

In response to Becker's correspondence, below, the offending
passages have been edited out of the following documents.


I have kept Maccabee's responses intact.  Unfortunately, because
of these deletions, the reader cannot know what parts of Becker's
text Maccabee is responding to.  I have no information on how
one may obtain the original article.

To my knowledge, Becker has not responded to the challenges
raised by Maccabee, only threatened legal action for copyright

Normally, we do not edit messages on the website after they
have been sent out on the mailing list.  Unless explicit
notices appear in the document, as they now appear in the
documents above, the reader can be assured that the document
appearing on the website is exactly the same text that went
out on the mailing list.

Glenn Campbell
Ufomind Webmaster


From: c549597@showme.missouri.edu
Date: Thu, 09 Oct 1997 10:36:55 -0500
To: brumac@compuserve.com
CC: updates@globalserve.net, steve@konsulting.com, campbell@ufomind.com
Subject: copyrighted paper


I have requested that Glenn Campbell remove the paper you recently wrote
using my 1990 paper.  He has refused.  I am writing to you to ask you to
ask him to remove it.

I spoke to a lawyer yesterday (if you wish to call her her number
is: 314-647-1200 ask for Annette Heller).  Since you are the original
infringer she thought I should ask you to ask him to take it off.
That seemed reasonable, so that is what I am doing.  ASK GLEN TO TAKE IT

I have all my E-mail from all of you.  AS well as my E-mail from John
Gilbert in the UK, which establishes my prior desire to have control of
my copyrighted paper.  I can demonstrate ownership, and that you ALL
know it was my paper.

If this gets to court, I can get injunctuive,  punitive and statuatory
damages from Glenn and punitive and statuatory from the rest of you.
Since you are all apparently have assests, and are stable, collecting a
judgment will not be difficult.

Punitive and statuatory carry fines from $500 to $20,000.  Then there is
the issue of WILLFULL infringement. That is where I ask Glenn to take it
off the website and he tells me to go to hell.  That's another $50,000
just from him. I should mention courts costs and lawyers fees can also
be asked for.

You see the way this works, you wrote the article, Steve forwarded
copyrighted materials, Errol allowed it on his list, (that too is
willfull since Errol edits the list) and Glenn has refused to remove it.
But it all falls back to you. AS long as it is reproduced without my
permission YOU are in violation of my copyright. So I think it is
important that you have it removed immediately so it is not downloaded
and reproduced.

All these years we have had a amicable relationship eventhough we dont
agree.  It would be a shame to mess everything up with a law suit.


Barbara Becker


[For the record, I did not exactly tell Beck to "go to hell."
Following is my actual response. -- GC]

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 13:40:21 -0800
To: c549597@showme.missouri.edu
From: campbell@ufomind.com (Glenn Campbell, Las Vegas)
Subject: Re: paper from maccabee

>On Saturday, October 4, a paper was posted by Jean van Gemmert FOR Bruce
>Maccabee. (Three parts). Maccabees paper uses copyrighted materials
>which he DID NOT have permission to reproduce in any form. I have no
>problem with HIS paper as long as he deletes MY text from it. I spoke
>with Errol about this and he suggested I contact you.  When I discovered
>that it had been reproduced on John Gilberts website in the UK I wrote
>and asked him to remove it which he graciously did. I would like it
>pulled from UFOMIND in its current form. Thank you.

Dear Barbara:

You are providing us with very little information to respond to. With
over 20,000 documents on our site, most of them generated
automatically, it is very hard for us to be a policing agency.

As a general policy, we do not edit or remove automatically generated
documents on our server.  We do occasionally remove copyrighted
documents upon request of the owner, but this case is more complicated.

You did not provide a URL.  I assume you are referring to the
document that begins at

I have not read the document in question, only skimmed it. The text
used appears to be included only in the context of a legitimate review
or analysis -- which is generally exempt from copyright protection.
Granted, Maccabee appears to have used a lot of your text, but in each
case he does so only to directly respond to it. This is consistent
with the way people respond to claims on the internet.  The vast
majority of the text in the posting appears to be Macabbee's,
and he is not trying to take credit for or seek any gain from your

At the same time, you are providing no information about your
copyright.  Where was this article first published? Did you register
this copyright?  (If so, a certificate number would be useful.)  Did a
copyright symbol appear on the article at the time it was first
published?  Has the article ever appeared on-line?

You also haven't even given your full name or any direct contact
information, which is certainly a  pre-requisite for copyright

We are in a difficult position.  If we grant this request, then every
time a person responds in this manner -- directly criticizing a quoted
piece of text -- then the person being criticized can claim copyright
infringement.  It will become a means of revenge or suppression for
those who are on the losing end of a debate.

As it stands, you have not given us enough information to act upon,
but should you wish to further respond, I suggest you put your
complaint in writing, along with your copyright information.  Save a
copy for your own records, and send the letter to me at:

      Glenn Campbell, Director
      Area 51 Research Center
      PO Box 448
      Rachel, NV 89001

Sending the letter by certified mail is recommended.  A copy of
the original article would also be helpful.

This will give us the basis for conducting further legal research.

Glenn Campbell
Ufomind Webmaster

|       U F O M I N D  -  M O T H E R S H I P                      |
|  "World's Largest and Best Organized UFO Website"         *      |
|                                                          ***     |
|       GLENN CAMPBELL - Moderator & Webmaster            *****    |
|                                                        *******   |
| Area 51 Research Center       campbell@ufomind.com    *********  |
| Las Vegas Annex             http://www.ufomind.com               |

Index: Barbara Becker

Search for other documents from or mentioning: campbell | c549597 | brumac

[ Next Message | Previous Message | This Day's Messages ]
This Month's Index |

UFO UpDates Main Index

UFO UpDates - Toronto - Operated by Errol Bruce-Knapp

Archive programming by Glenn Campbell at Glenn-Campbell.com