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'Its All Here In Black & White'
Location: UFOUpDatesList.Com > 1997 > Apr > Apr 9

Re: 'Beyond Belief'

From: James Easton <pulsar@compuserve.com>
Date: Tue, 8 Apr 1997 21:20:28 -0400
Fwd Date: Wed, 9 Apr 1997 14:06:14 -0800
Subject: Re: 'Beyond Belief'


>Date: 07 Apr 97 14:46:03 EDT
>From: BOB SHELL <76750.2717@CompuServe.COM>
>Subject: Re: UFO UpDate: 'Beyond Belief'

Bob wrote:

>I have just spent the past three days correcting page proofs of
>_Beyond Roswell_.  Much of it has been revised based on feedback on
>the Nexus article.

We're no longer claiming to have "verified every important detail of
the cameraman's story"?

That's what Hesemann reminded you of only last month.

>Don't you think it would be more useful to wait until the book has
>been published, and to make your comments based on the final printed

I may be adept at forecasting rain for Wimbledon, but I do not profess
to be psychic. I didn't realise the claims were so volatile.

>The IRT which we set up consists of Michael Hesemann, Philip Mantle,
>Maurizio Baiata, myself, and a few others. It is an informal group,
>and we have no membership card, certificate, secret handshake, or
>decoder rings.

Ha! So you say.

>Just a common interest in giving the AA film a fair hearing.

It's had a fair hearing, some would say more than generous.

And so it should have, but perhaps all the factual inaccuracies,
distortions and plain old bull offered in it's defence are outside the
Marquis of Queensberry rules.

>>Shell had apparently simply telephoned the Rockefeller Archives...

>So, James, are you saying that you have done no research by

No and thrice no, it's the paucity of the research - it should be
pointed out that you were the first to say it was only preliminary
research - and how those brief facts are used by others to suit their
own agenda.

But you're part of the same "team" and if you're not part of the

>It was confirmed by these researchers that the archive has very
>complete holdings of Dr. Bronk's papers for other years, but that for
>1947 all they have is a couple of personal letters in which he
>discusses his vacation for the following year.  No this is not
>conclusive proof of anything, but coupled with much other
>circumstantial evidence is very suggestive.

Can we truly say it's suggestive of anything other than his personal
papers for that year are perhaps scarce? Does this merit dark
suspicions that Dr Bronk was involved in an "alien autopsy" as Ray
Santilli implies?

I wonder what his family would think if they saw this accusation.

>>To my knowledge, Ray Santilli has never said that the "cameraman"
>>made this claim.

>>How would the "cameraman" have known anyway?

>I agree that Michael misspoke here.

Here, there and everywhere.

>I don't think the cameraman ever mentioned the mine.

No, I didn't think that Ray Santilli ever mentioned this.

>However, the reopening of the mine at just this time when it had been
>shut down for years is another piece of circumstantial evidence.

That depends on a number of factors.

Firstly, you have to establish a credible basis for believing that
something of significance happened there at that particular time. I
would suggest there are few who believe that evidence exists, or is

You would then at least need some hard evidence that with no prior
intimations, the mine was suddenly reopened and at great haste around
the same time. From the documents I've seen, the mine was privately
owned and leased to the National Zinc Corporation. What is the
evidence that the US government "invited" them to open the mine, and
so on.

>The cameraman very specifically says it was on the side of a dry lake
>bed, and careful reading of the geological appraisal of the area in
>the government report on the Niggerhead deposits finds no mention of
>any dry lake beds in this area.

What can I say.

>Linda Moulton Howe has verified that Stone did discuss this prior to
>the AA film becoming public. Not only that, but he drew for her a
>graphic sketch in which a six-fingered hand and arm are clearly

In the interview Stone gave to Ted Loman on Feb. 20, 1996, he claimed
to have seen several films at Fort Belvior in 1969. There were
saucer-shaped UFOs, cigar-shaped UFOs, films of bodies lying around,
some live aliens, etc. - the usual stuff. He didn't mention any
six-fingered aliens, but did comment, "There were several types of
bodies. There were some who were reminiscent of these little grey
guys, don't ask me about digits as far as fingers or toes....".

I've also seen a similar interview with Stone on the "alien autopsy"
based, "Roswell: The Investigation Continues" video, which it seems
was never released.

I couldn't begin to tell how believable Mr Stone isn't.

>>With the "intelligence grapevine" being somewhat inadmissible
>>evidence, it seems all we can conclude is that Shell called Captain
>>McAndrew and a conversation took place.

>If you are going to tell a story, tell all of it.

For brevity, I didn't mention the entire story as it wasn't relevant
to the fact that Hesemann had "misspoke" about the USAF contacting
you, following an enquiry from Pres. Clinton's scientific advisor.

There's no reason to doubt that you spoke to McAndrew.

>I did the internet bit some time ago, and spent time on the phone
>with people at the DataHand company. Mr. Retter was not available
>when I called and did not return my calls.

I'm sure he's a busy man.

If you had located the same information, which as I mentioned to you
includes the report of a conversation with Mr Retter and references
a paper he co-authored, it seems strange that a "professional"
couldn't find any evidence that he "really exists".

Aside from establishing that there is evidence for Mr Retter's
existence, which has been done, it is my personal opinion that any
conspiratorial suggestions involving said Mr Retter are of zero value
and probably libellous.

We can but await the revised version of the evidence supporting the
authenticity of Ray's video and story.

Your comments are much appreciated.

E-mail: pulsar@compuserve.com

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